The Butter Room is thrilled to interview Ann McDaniel, the Director of the Warehouse, the official Dave Matthews Band fan association that is celebrating it’s tenth year at the end of 08! With Dave Matthews Band’s summer tour kicking off today at Post Gazette Pavilion in Burgettstown, PA, we felt it apropos to interview the person who runs the best fan club around. Ann moved to Charlottesville for her position as Director of the Warehouse in the fall of 2001. Originally from Birmingham, AL and a graduate of the University of the South (Sewanee) with a BS in Natural Resources, she loves calling Charlottesville home and admits to feeling blessed to have a job she loves!


You’ve been the Director of the DMB Warehouse since 2001. How did the opportunity come about?

Ann McDaniel: It was very serendipitous; I had been working in Athens, GA as Executive Director of an environmental nonprofit and was looking to move and for a change. I sent my resume to Coran Capshaw through mutual friends and the fan club director position had just become available. It was perfect timing, I flew up for the interview and moved to Charlottesville a month later.


The Warehouse has a pretty sizeable membership. What has been the secret to its success?

Ann: We have a steady loyal base of fans in the Warehouse fan association. We offer Warehouse members a nice allotment of tickets prior to public on sales; we send them a live fan club only release of songs each year and provide great customer service plus opportunities for meet and greets and ticket upgrades. All for the reasonable annual fee of $35.


What is a “day in the life” of running the Warehouse?

Ann: My day varies based on projects and the time of year. I run the Bama charity auctions, post updates to all sites: DMB, Warehouse, Facebook, MySpace, write and coordinate email blasts, assist with ticketing projects, respond to Warehouse emails and phone calls. The list goes on but those are the top activities that keep me plenty busy.


What are the favorite parts of your job, and how does it feel to have a job that tens of thousands would love to have?

Ann: My favorite part of the job is working with such a great, dedicated team and for such an amazing band of philanthropic artists. We work hard for DMB and we accomplish a lot. When I go to a Dave Matthews Band show and look around at the tens of thousands of fans enjoying themselves, it is a very proud moment as thousands of those fans are Warehouse members! I do not really ever think about having a job that others covet; my job may seem glamorous to those on the outside but trust me, it’s a lot of work!


DMB performing at The Concert for Virginia Tech on 9/6/07; photo by Todd Wickersty

The summer tour kicks off this week. Is there anything new and/or different that fans can expect this year?

Ann: Well, sadly, Butch Taylor is leaving DMB and he will be missed. On the bright side, DMB has been working in the studio with longtime friend Tim Reynolds, who will be joining the band on tour this summer. We are all hoping for a taste of some new material from the studio.


Approximately how many DMB shows had you seen before becoming Director of the Warehouse, and how many have you seen since? What have been your favorites and why?

Ann: My first DMB shows were right out of college in the mid 90s, the Georgia Theatre in Athens, the Fox Theatre in Atlanta. I truly do not know how many I’ve been to - I probably need to sit down and figure the total for posterity’s sake (ha ha). My favorite moments have occurred at the shows at Red Rocks, the Roseland Ballroom, Central Park and with friends at VA Beach and Shoreline. This summer I am greatly looking forward to the Greek Theatre shows, the last one is my birthday (and LeRoi’s :)


What other music have you been listening to lately and would recommend to our readers?

Ann: I LOVE In Rainbows by Radiohead, it’s been in heavy rotation for some time now (saw Radiohead in northern VA recently and it was 2 hours of perfection in spite of the chilly temps and incessant rain). I have also been listening to Frank by Amy Winehouse, KT Tunstall, My Morning Jacket (looking forward to the June 10th ATO release: Evil Urges). I listen to Radio Paradise at work almost daily and love their playlists which have introduced me to lots of artists.


DMB performing at The Concert for Virginia Tech on 9/6/07; photo by Todd Wickersty

I understand you are heavily involved with Bama Works, DMB’s charitable program in the Charlottesville area. What are some of the activities and charities that Bama Works supports?

Ann: There are way too many to list so I invite readers to check http://www.davematthewsband.com/bama/charities/. The most recent is the Bama Green project which encompasses all of the environmental efforts undertaken by the band while on the road, in the studio or at home. In addition to working with the band, the Bama Green Project is also dedicated to educating DMB fans around the world about how to take simple & positive environmental actions. More info may be found at www.reverbrock.org/dmb.

Dave Matthews Band should be highly commended for their work through Bama Works. They started a Village Recovery Fund after the terrible tsunami in Sri Lanka, they began the Bama Works Youth Initiative to educate high school children about philanthropy through hands-on education and execution of charitable projects, they supported and issued a challenge grant for the Habitat for Humanity Musician’s Village in New Orleans as well as distributed monies raised at the Red Rocks show for Katrina Relief to various relief charities. I could go on and on…


When you are not working, you are …

Ann: Working in my flower and vegetable gardens, taking photographs, seeing live music, enjoying delicious food and wine with my beau and friends! I also do a lot of volunteer work. I am court appointed special advocate with Piedmont CASA and work with children that are involved in abuse, neglect or custody cases. I have been involved with the Junior League of Charlottesville since ‘01 and recently completed my Charlottesville Albemarle Tree Steward training. Next on my list is becoming a certified Master Naturalist.

Trees on Fire are set to play their second show in as many years at Charlottesville’s Fridays After Five tomorrow, 5/9/08. The Butter Room was lucky enough to catch up with Trees’ drummer, Paul Rosner, before the show for some question and answer time.


What’s the songwriting process like? Do lyrics come first and then music or the other way around? Is there a primary lyricist in the group?

Paul Rosner: Generally, Rob or Blake will bring the skeleton of a song to the group first. The skeleton includes melody, lyrics, and a basic chord progression, though things can and do change once the band has gotten ahold of the song. At that point, we spend a lot of time working on the basic grooves/feel of the different parts, as well as figuring out what instruments to use. That often means Justin has to decide which of his many toys to pull out, but Rob has been playing less guitar in the group lately, so he also has decisions to make. Sometimes, those decisions come about after we’ve tried a few different arrangements, and other times, songs evolve after we’ve played them live a few times.


What’s been the most successful show you’ve had both in terms of turnout and performance? Were they the same show?

Paul: In terms of turnout, the most successful shows we’ve had were 3/13/08 at Satellite Ballroom here in Cville and last April’s CD release party for The Green Room, which took place at Starr Hill. We had the room completely packed and sold out at the latter, and had a big, raucous crowd at the former that was singing along loudly, dancing like mad, and generally giving out amazingly strong energy. I would say this last show at Satellite was also one of our best, though we’re never completely happy with a performance. I guess that’s pretty normal.


You are all very skilled musicians and performers - do you take requests at shows?

Paul: We don’t really take requests, mostly because we spend a lot of time working on highly specified arrangements of our original songs, and obviously we’re anxious to play them for people. The songs keep evolving, growing, and getting stronger each time we perform, so I think they stay pretty fresh. In the past, however, we have taken a few requests of our own songs (and the occasional cover).


What’s your favorite cover that you play live?

Paul: I really enjoy playing “Walking on the Moon” by the Police and “If You Want Me to Stay” by Sly and the Family Stone. The Police have always been one of my all-time favorite bands (I got to see them at Bonnaroo last summer), and they are a big influence on Trees on Fire, particularly when we first formed. The Sly song has been a favorite of mine for a while, and it’s one of the few songs I sing lead on, so that’s fun for me.


How do you try to manage the balance between socially responsible/political lyrics without sounding preachy and potentially turning people off from the music?

Paul: That’s a great question and one that we wrestle with when considering what causes to support. There’s no denying that each of us are very concerned with social responsibility, but we want to show people the folly of our ways in an uplifting and non-judgemental way. We are very very lucky to have lyricists who seem to be able to find this balance naturally and don’t have to force it. “Take a Seat” is a good example of that balance. The lyrics observe: “we take a seat, take a seat in our cars. We drive around making everything ours, but as we get to the end of our road, we realize there’s something else than gold. Don’t wait around.” Clearly, there’s a problem presented in this verse, but the author includes himself as part of the problem and basically concludes that we should all begin looking for solutions right away. It also helps that this song is musically uplifting and hopeful, which fits well with the lyrics.


When is the new record coming out and what can Trees on Fire fans expect compared to last year’s “The Green Room”?

Paul: We are hard at work recording the new album as we speak (tentatively titled “Organica”) and expect it to be done around the end of summer. The new songs tend toward a little darker sound with more dance beats and influence than The Green Room. We’re getting better at figuring out our sound as we go, and I think we have a collection of 12-15 songs that not only continue to show all aspects of our musicianship but also have a true Trees on Fire “sound.” Defining that sound is always difficult, but we’re creating what we like to think of our own sub-genre, Organica.


What/Who are Trees on Fire greatest influences?

Paul: We have many, but some of the biggest are Bob Marley, Radiohead, Bach, The Roots, and Stevie Wonder, among others. These vocal artists all combine inspiration in music and words like prophets, and Bach is just genius personified. Other styles influence our sound as well, including jazz, ska, soul (new and old), klezmer, baroque, and hard rock.


I caught you guys at the Satellite Ballroom in March. What’s the story behind the belly dancers? Do they make regular appearances at your shows?

Paul: The belly dancers are a semi-regular part of our performances, partly because we love the energy they bring to our music. Their dancing adds an exotic element to what we do, which we consider somewhat exotic by itself. It’s a pretty potent combination. At the Satellite show, Shaheen and Lindsay worked out involved routines for a couple songs, so we couldn’t resist getting them up on stage to add to the madness. We look at ourselves as kind of a living circus on stage, so it seems natural for belly dancers to be a part of it.


What is the best live performance you have ever seen in person?

Paul: That is a tough question. I am going to see Radiohead for the first time this Sunday - my birthday - so I may have to wait on a definite answer, but I will give you a couple of my highlights.

R.E.M. in 1984 at the Fox Theatre in Atlanta along with the Minutemen; Fishbone in 1991 at Trax in Charlottesville (such ridiculously high energy); U2 in 1985 at the Omni in Atlanta (touring to support The Unforgettable Fire, which is my favorite U2 album); Herbie Hancock in 2002 at 9:30 Club in DC.


What do you think of the current music scene in Charlottesville? Who do you recommend catching live?

Paul: The music scene is Cville is hopping right now. Ten years ago, it seemed like there wasn’t much orignial music going on in town, but I am constantly amazed by the talent on display these days: Birdlips, Beetnix, Kings of Belmont, and Acoustic Groove Trio, just to name a few. You can even catch Beetnix playing with Trees on Fire at Satellite Ballroom on May 23. It’s sure to be one of the last ever shows at Satellite, so it will be a special night that’s full of surprises.



Into the Fire - Trees on Fire from The Butter Room on Vimeo.



Birds & the Bees - Trees on Fire from The Butter Room on Vimeo.

This Friday in Charlottesville, Kings of Belmont will make their Fridays After Five debut.

Who are the Kings of Belmont?

Well, their bio states:

The well-established bonds of their friendship allowed The Kings of Belmont to meld together quickly as a band, and their diverse range allowed them the flexibility to explore and express just the right sound without being constrained within a specific genre or style. The Kings of Belmont will have you punching the sky with rockers like “Play For Free” and “Entertainment & Arts” and then have you two-steppin’ to “Talking To Myself”. “Keanu Reeves” and “Git r Done” will have you bobbing your head and laughing at the cynical lyrics mocking pop culture while “South Bound” will keep your feet moving through an extended improvisational jam. Whether its rock or country or hip-hop or jams, you will find it woven into the sound of The Kings of Belmont.

I caught the KOB for the first time last week at the Satellite Ballroom. They opened up for Tea Leaf Green, and it was the best show that I have seen this year (video below). We caught up with John Spagnolo, the drummer of Kings of Belmont, to prep you for their performance this Friday in Charlottesville.

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How did Kings of Belmont get it’s start and how are you dealing with the groups’ meteoric rise as one of Charlottesville’s best bands?

John Spagnolo: The group started with just Ross van Brocklin (guitar, vocals, keys) and Aaron Ahlbrandt (keys) and their friend Drum Machine hanging out in Ross’ basement serenading each other and trading off songwriting duties. They played a few gigs around town most notably at the late Atomic Burrito and started attracting some loyal fans. Yearning for the power of a full band, Ross and Aaron approached Max Collins (guitar, vocals) and me (drums) about joining/starting the ‘band’. The four of us had played together in our Ween tribute band, Peen, so it was a good fit right off the bat. We still break out some Ween songs, but it’s refreshing to be able to work on our own material. Our friend Dan Sheets filled in on bass in the beginning and when he moved on we recruited Chris Coleman, formerly of the The Grove.



As for the “meteoric rise”…you are too kind and I will be sure to quote you in our press kit.

Things have been stepping up lately for us, and it’s been great. We’ve been doing a monthly gig at r2…we’ve played there enough that we are really comfortable there, so those shows always end up being off the hook. Plus our fan base is great…they rock…hard. Makes for great live shows.

We’ve got Friday’s After Five this week and that will put us in front of a ton of new faces…they may start throwing those weird plastic long neck beer bottles at us….you know the ones that try to make you think you’re drinking out of a bottle instead of a plastic cup…can I just have an ice cold can of beer? Check back next week and I’ll let you know how it went.

We also have a gig in NYC coming up soon and later in the summer we’ll playing at Floydfest.

Breaking into new towns is humbling…it’s like starting all over again each night.

What are some of KOB’s main influences (musical and not so musical)?

John: Easy answer, Ween…they’ll rock your face off and then make you sob like a little bitch to a sappy love song. We dig ‘em. I think one of the things that work for us as a band and as friends is that we don’t take ourselves too serious. We never want to be one of those bands that cop a big attitude or try too hard to put on some bullshit act. Who we are on stage is who we are off stage. We laugh a lot…that’s reflected in some of our completely stupid songs…but they make us laugh so we keep playing them. Like “Keanu Reeves” or “Jerk Store” or “Git r Done”…all influenced by pop culture and our sense of humor.

I see you guys are starting to take the show on the road this summer with appearances in NYC, Roanoke, and Floydfest. Are there other out of town performances in the works this summer?

John: Hopefully, we’ve been talking to some places in Harrisonburg, Richmond and Lynchburg about getting in. Oh yeah, and Nags Head too…I look great with a sunburn. We’d like to beef out the schedule but not over saturate Cville.

Are you going to perform “Jerk Store” at Fridays given it’s “family friendly” environment?

John: We thought about trying to do a “clean” version, but then said “fuck it”. No Jerk Store this time. (Butter Room side note: You can check out “Jerk Store” here.)

With the emergence of the super group that is KOB, what does this mean for Peen?

John: Peen is definitely on the back burner for now…but don’t worry, not lost forever. Peen is great to pull out for those special occasions when you want to get down and dirty. There will be more Peen shows. As a matter of fact, the original founder of Peen, Mike Ketola just moved back to Cville after being in Seattle for a couple years. If that’s not a special occasion to get down and dirty then I don’t know what is!

What’s the groups’ favorite Keanu Reeves performance?

John:How could we narrow his awesomeness to just one performance? Skills like his can only be considered a blessing. But if you insist…I’d have to say the pairing of Keanu Reeves with Patrick Swayze in Point Break is one heck of a treat.

How much do you miss the Starr Hill cocktail lounge?

John: Aaahhh, the glory days. We loved playing downstairs at Starr Hill! We would talk with the folks at Starr Hill about going upstairs because we could fit more people….but we always decided that the vibe was right downstairs…so we stayed there. Plus we were close to the bar and could get our Jager shots quick.

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Here is the KOB performing “Beg For More” from the Satellite Ballroom on April 17, 2008:

Beg For More - Kings of Belmont from The Butter Room on Vimeo.

Check out the Kings of Belmont on:
MySpace and Facebook

If you are a Charlottesville resident, you are more than likely familiar with the city’s favorite sons and musical exports of country rock, Sons of Bill. Whether they are selling out Satellite Ballroom here locally, or playing to packed houses in DC and NYC, where they recently have sold out shows at IOTA Club and Knitting Factory respectively, it’s obvious that people all over the east coast are responding to what these boys do. And with their recent signing with Red Light Management, I suspect that it won’t be long before they are playing to crowds across the country. Sam Wilson, guitarist extraordinaire for the Sons (also one of the three brothers in the band, and yes their father is named Bill) sat down with us and took the time away from gearing up for their season-opening performance this Friday, April 18th, at Fridays After Five, to answer a few questions.

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What’s been in the van CD player lately? Do all of the guys usually agree on listening, and if not what are some divergences? I know, for instance, that you are a closet metal fan, how would something like Slayer go over in the van? Any others surprise tastes in the band?

Sam Wilson: We usually hook up an iPod to the van speakers and each person take turns listening depending who’s driving. We also will listen to our own iPods as well if we feel like having our own time. We definitely have similar and different tastes on music. Some artists that we all love and agree on are: Whiskeytown, Steve Earle, Bruce Springsteen, Sheryl Crow, Alice in Chains, Gram Parsons, Wilco, Son Volt, G n’ R; basically the country/rock genre. Sometimes James will get whiny when Seth and I throw on hip-hop, world, indie or more experimental stuff as he is more of an American rock n’ roll guy. Although, James and I do share a love for metal and on late night drives I have been known to throw on Slayer, Megadeth, Dokken, Pantera, Alice in Chains, or Nirvana. Caputo and I share the love of Radiohead and “Kid A” has been played a lot in the van, as well as Ryan Adams. Caputo is also really into the “Thrill Jockey” record label. Abe is a big Pink Floyd fan as well. I guess we have our standbys that keep everyone happy and then the stuff that one of us will love and then proceed to get berated for listening to such rubbish.

What are some other local and/or regional bands that you all are fans of?

Sam: One regional band that we love is the Wrinkle Neck Mules. They are a great Americana band based out of Richmond. Unfortunately they are spread across the country now, but we have a show with them June 7th at Iota in northern Virginia. Another band we love are The Navigators. They are a great country/rock band I used to go see when I lived in New York CIty. Abe is a big fan of Jupiter One which a synth/pop band we have played with several times and is based out of NYC. We all love Jim Waive and the Young Divorcees and have all played/recorded with their phenomenal pedal-steel player, Charlie Bell.

What’s on tap for the rest of the year for the band? Are you working on a new record? Do you plan to expand your touring to include new areas?

Sam: SOB plan on recording our new record this summer. We hope to release it ourselves and then maybe sell it to a label. We have been working on about 14 new tunes and really hope to get a good producer for the record. James still writes most of the songs but there is more collaboration on this record. I will have 2-3 songs that I have written and will sing on this record. Seth also has a great song that James will sing and Abe will have a great tune that he will sing on the album.

I guess we have been an east coast touring band (besides our USO tour) but hope to get out to the west coast and hopefully keep expanding. But we also want to keep a solid home life as well.

Where, other than Charlottesville, is your favorite place to play?

Sam: SOB does really well in DC, Richmond, and the Carolinas (Charlotte, Raleigh, Chapel Hill) and we have had the opportunity to open for some great bands like Reckless Kelly, Cracker, Cross Canadian Ragweed, and Robert Randolph and the Family Band.

You guys did a USO tour last year. Tell us a bit about that.

Sam: We traveled to Guam, Korea, Japan and Okinawa on our USO tour. We did 23 shows in 30 days so it was pretty much a whirlwind experience. The short number of days we got to sightsee was awesome but I wish we could have had more time to explore. Sometimes we would play for 25 people at a small Air Force base and then we would be at a festival with over a thousand people. The response we got was almost always positive, as the troops were very appreciative to have some live music and a taste of home. We also got managed to sell over 350 CDs.

In what ways has the band changed since you started out, musically or otherwise? In what ways has it stayed the same?

Sam: One way the band is changed is everyone is a lot more experienced and less green in the live and studio setting. James has become much more accustomed to really playing and singing solid shows as he has performed over 100 shows in the past year. Seth and Abe have also contributed in invaluable ways and have really stepped up to the plate. While Caputo and I have been professional musicians for many years we have also learned our role in this band and have learned so much more than I ever could have imagined about country music. I think the harmony singing between the brothers has gotten pretty razor sharp over the past 3 years as well.

You’ve also been working on a solo record. Tell us a little about that…

Sam: I have been working on a solo album with my band that I began in June of 2007. It features songs that I have written over the past 3 years. It spans the genres of rock, folk, country, and just ambient-type music. It is something I have been wanting to do for years and finally all the stars aligned and the right cast of characters came along to help this band come to fruition. The core of the band is myself, Brian Chenault on electric guitars and vocals, and Brian Caputo on drums and vocals. Without these two guys, I never could have done this project. Brian Chenault is probably the only guitar player in the world that I would trust to write electric guitar parts on my songs. He constantly amazes me with his creativity, knowledge, groove, sound and harmony singing. We also share a love of metal and over the top guitar playing! Brian Caputo and I have been playing music together for over 8 years and he is my favorite drummer in the world. He really understands my music and has been encouraging me to put this band together for quite some time now. There are several great bass players (Darrell Muller and Forrest Burtnette) and keys (Wells Hanley) that are included in the group as well and have helped make the band what it is. The record is due out in late May. We have about 6 shows under our belt and hope to keep playing as we already have almost enough tunes for another record.

In The Butter Room / Jane Copland, Search Marketing Consultant Ah, so this is The Butter Room … it’s everything I imagined and more! Seriously, though, I am excited to be a part of such a talented group of professionals and I’m even more excited about my first contribution to this unique site. First, allow myself to introduce … myself … I’m Gary Cope, the In-house Search Engine Optimization and Marketing Professional for a company in Roanoke, Va. I also founded and run CWI Media & Marketing. If you want more detail, check out my bio. The bottom line is, I spend about 10-14 hours a day working on search engine optimization. SEO is a never-ending learning process, mostly in part because the search engines (Google, Yahoo!, Ask, MSN) are constantly modifying their algorithms to adjust for changes in the SEO landscape and to combat Black Hat SEO practices. The biggest part of my job is keeping up with those changes and that means reading a lot (and I mean A LOT) of SEO-related blogs. And that brings us to our interviewee Jane Copland, a Search Marketing Consultant for SEOMoz.org. Jane has established herself as one of the most respected search marketing professionals in the business. SEOMoz is a Seattle-based SEO company that serves as a hub for search marketers worldwide, providing education, tools, resources and paid services. Photo of Jane is Property of SEOMoz.org. The Butter Room thanks Jane for her time and response.

For those who may not be familiar with your background, can you give us a quick overview and a little bit of info about SEOMoz?

Jane Copland: SEOmoz is a search marketing company based in Seattle, Washington. We specialise in creating both SEO tools and in creating educational content for the search marketing community, as well as maintaining a popular Q&A service and a daily SEO blog. I started working here in September 2006. Looking back, I was incredibly lucky to get this job: there were over 100 applicants, many (most?) of whom were way more qualified to work here than I was. However, I made it through the rather grueling interview process SEOmoz had set up and have been working here for almost a year and a half. Before that, I attended Washington State University and competed on the school’s swim team for four years. I’m originally from New Zealand, but I’ve been living in the U.S. for six years now.

You’ve been in the SEO business for about 18 months, yet you have established yourself as one of the industry’s most respected SEO professionals in such a relatively short period of time. With apologies to Michael J. Fox, what is the secret of your success?

Jane: I’m very lucky to be working at SEOmoz, really. The blog was very visible and respected long before I walked through the front door, so I had a good place from which to start! Along with that, I’ve fallen in love with my work, which makes it easy to learn fast.

What is your favorite part of SEO and why? Your least favorite and why?

Jane: My favourite part is probably figuring out the reason why something isn’t working and fixing it. I love material results like that. My least-liked thing in SEO is when the “pieces don’t fit together” and I can’t work out why something is happening. Sometimes, you’ve done everything right, you’ve been smart and clever and you’re sure something will go right and it doesn’t. I don’t like it when there is no explanation or foreseeable way to fix a problem.

SEO, relative to other industries, is in its infancy and as such, there do not appear to be any universally recognized code of ethics or standards. With respect to SEMPO (of which I am a member), there doesn’t seem to be a professional organization that has taken a commanding lead to create such standards and ethics for our profession. Do you think there should be a set of standards and ethics to govern the rapidly growing SEO industry?

Jane: That’s a tough question in regards to the Internet as a whole and not just SEO. How much should the Internet be regulated? I believe we’ll see some codes of ethics popping up over the next year or two: it will be interesting to see whose standards are adopted as authoritative.

Following up on the previous question … more and more colleges and universities are beginning to offer courses focusing on search engine marketing and optimization, but without a set of standards and ethics, are there concerns or even discussions amongst the current SEO professionals about what is being taught in these courses?

Jane: It’s scary to think what people might teach college kids about SEO. I was in college two years ago (so, two minutes ago!) and there was enough disagreement amongst my professors about older industries and practices. I’d hate to think about the conflicting messages students could get when they’re being taught about an industry that is so young. The sad thing is, I have friends who graduated with marketing and advertising degrees and they were never taught anything about SEO or SEM. So people with degrees from 2006 know next to nothing about online marketing.

Web 2.0 is everywhere, but what the heck is it. Was there even a Web 1.0? Kidding : ) What is Web 2.0 and how will it affect SEO going forward?

Jane: Web 2.0 is too big of a phenomenon to sum up quickly. Basically, I don’t think there is a “Web 2.0”; rather, there’s just the progression of the Internet. Unfortunately, we’ve already named our Web 2.0 Awards and branded them accordingly! In terms of how this affects SEO, it highlights how important it is to keep learning and not to become too attached to any particular way of doing things. The industry has changed remarkably since I joined and if I did the same things I did in my first month or two here, I’d be failing.

Social Networking is another popular buzz word with regards to the Web … what does it mean and what is its role in SEO?

Jane: Honeslty, social networking means far less to SEO than it does to SMM, or social media marketing. You can promote a brand very effectively with social network marketing, but we’ve found that search engines aren’t keen on using social networks’ data. Of course, they can’t even use Facebook data, and Facebook is by far the best social networking service. In terms of establishing oneself within any industry, social networking can be very useful, however.

What is the biggest myth about SEO?

Jane: That playing around on Digg all day is a legitimate SEO practice ; )

Free style time! This is your open forum to tell our readers about - well, about anything that’s near and dear to your heart. SEO, swimming, being a Kiwi, whatever - have at it.

Jane: Well! This sounds like a good place for a “things you don’t know about me” list, since I’m finding it tough to come up with a good paragraph!

1. I nearly didn’t open SEOmoz’s job post and apply for the job because it was 1am and I thought it might be time to go to bed.
2. I held the New Zealand record for the 200m breaststroke for four years. My mother ran for Great Britain in the 1970s and yet neither of us particularly like sport.
3. For two years, I lived in the U.S. Virgin Islands.
4. I have a degree in English, not marketing, computer science or anything related to SEO. I couldn’t even write basic HTML until two weeks after I began working here.
5. I haven’t been back to New Zealand in five years (my parents live in Florida), but I’ll get a few days in Auckland on the way back from SMX Sydney in April. It will be really strange to be surrounded by New Zealanders again.

Last question: What is your favorite Kiwi word/saying that most Americans may not have heard.

Jane: Ooh, gosh… I have to share more than one! Some of them are British as well.

1. Bob’s your uncle - translates as, “and there you go” or “everything will be okay.” Used in a sentence. “You stick the keyword in your meta keywords tag 42 times and Bob’s your uncle.”
2. Trolleyed: drunk.
3. Whinging Pom: Englishman who complains a lot.
4. Yank tank: Large American car.
5. Prang: small car accident, usually involving another car. Consider it a translation for “fender bender.”
6. Piss-up: party where everyone gets trolleyed!

Closing notes from Gary: Jane was extremely busy this week preparing for the upcoming Search Marketing Expo (SMX) West Conference next week in Santa Clara, so she went out of her way to make time for this interview. Thanks again Jane, we really appreciate it! Now, if you’ll excuse me, I think I’ll go get trolleyed at a piss-up, but don’t worry, I promise not to drive my yank tank home - I’ll take a cab and, well, Bob’s your uncle. G’night everybody - I’ll be here all week!

(This was originally published on our old platform on January 23, 2008)

Marco Arment is the Lead Developer at Davidville, which is the development company that is the brainchild behind Tumblr, the very popular tumblelog publishing tool. If you are not familiar with Tumblr, I encourage you to sign up for an account or at least, read my attempt at a Tumbler 101 column that I posted earlier in the week (and then sign up).

Marco’s bio on his website reads:

I’m currently the Lead Developer at Davidville, a software development consultancy in New York City. (East Midtown Manhattan, to be more precise.) We design, build, and maintain web applications primarily for local startup companies, and offer advisory consulting for internet business and trends.

From 2004 through mid-2006, I was a Software Developer and the Chief Firefox Toolbar Architect (they never let me put that part on my business cards) at Vivisimo, the company behind Clusty, in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. In my time at Vivisimo, I developed strong knowledge of search engine technology and the search business, as well as an unhealthy proficiency in C and XSL.

I graduated from Allegheny College in 2004 with a B.S. in Computer Science.

Photo of Marco is property of Marco Arment.

The Butter Room thanks Marco for his time and response.

***

I discovered Tumblr about a month ago (I forgot how) and am completely hooked. I don’t know if I am considered an early adopter since Tumblr has more than 200K users, but I only know two other people who have Tumblr accounts. Yet, I have about 100 friends on Facebook. I know Facebook has a billion members, but my point is that some of my friends know how to use the internet. Therefore, as the Lead Developer of Davidville how would describe Tumblr to my ignorant circle of friends so they will sign up tomorrow?

Marco Arment: Tumblr is a publishing tool, first and foremost. Like Blogger or WordPress, we run a hosted service for people to publish content online. Instead of blogs, we let you create tumblelogs. Our Help page defines tumblelogs well as “more structured blogs that make it easier, faster, and more fun to post and share stuff you find or create.”

Keeping up a good blog is a lot of work - millions of people have started blogs and abandoned them because they got tired of the constant need for long, original, editorial content that hardly anyone would actually bother reading.

Tumblelogs encourage shorter content and don’t require complete originality in every post. Instead of spending two hours every day writing one giant article, you can quickly post a handful of smaller items as you browse the internet normally. It takes almost no additional time or effort - you’re just clicking the bookmarklet and typing a few words here and there.

And at the end of the day, you can look back with pride and say, “Wow! I made that!” It’s very fulfilling.

I read here that you were considering several opportunities when you joined Davidville in June 2006. Since Tumblr was still in the idea stage and Davidville was primarily providing consulting services, what attracted you to work for Davidville at the time?

Marco: David’s very persuasive! (I hope he never learns that there’s this other industry called “sales”, because he’d be very good at it, and it would be a complete waste of his talent.)

When the time came that I wanted to move, I had to choose between a high-paying, big-company job in the finance industry (Bloomberg) or working for this random guy, younger than me, who had really good ideas. My family encouraged me to take the more secure position at Bloomberg, worrying that this random guy wouldn’t be around in 6 months and my paychecks would bounce.

I program financial software I didn’t care about in FORTRAN on weird custom Windows PCs with a bunch of people who rubbed me the wrong way. Or I could make web applications in my favorite language (PHP) with this cool guy and he’d buy me a brand new Mac of my choice to use full-time.

My family lost that one.

Tumblr 3.0 was released November 1 full of new features. Which features did you develop and/or lead the development for?

Marco: David designed all of them and I programmed all of them. Nothing was done entirely by just one of us. That’s part of the beauty of small teams: everyone does everything.

Most of my time was spent splitting apart the database schemas and back-end code to enable 3.0’s new features. It was massive - more than half of Tumblr’s code changed between 2.0 and 3.0. Some features were completely scrapped and rewritten.

Which features have received the most positive feedback from the user base since the release?

Marco: We got positive feedback on nearly everything. The new interface, audio and video uploads, and private posts are probably the most popular improvements. We added Markdown support, which is very popular among power users. And we made some architectural changes that helped people’s tumblelogs index better in search engines.

The biggest gains in 3.0 were the dramatic improvements of the existing functionality. Image quality was dramatically improved. Mobile email parsing was completely rewritten to support more phones, services, and file formats. The entire architecture was made much faster, and the codebase is better structured to support better and faster feature development.

What’s being worked on for the next release? Can you give the Butter Room a sneak preview?

Marco: No, sorry. You’ll have to wait for David’s keynote speech at Tumblrworld ‘08 in June.

About the same time I signed up for Tumblr, I also joined Twitter. Then I found this post on another tumblelog a few days ago. I agree with it 100%. I don’t know why anyone would use Twitter instead of Tumblr. The user experience is so much richer. Do you view Twitter as a competitor or a service that augments Tumblr? or something completely different?

Marco: Twitter isn’t a competitor to Tumblr. It serves a very different function, and they’ve optimized their site to do that one thing extremely well.

Twitter isn’t for publishing, and Tumblr isn’t for sending all of your friends SMS alerts whenever you eat breakfast. Both services excel at completely different things. There isn’t much overlap.

Since I only have 2 friends using Tumblr, I currently pull my Tumblr RSS feed into Facebook. The Tumblr users group on Facebook is growing at a steady pace (330 members last I checked). Is there a plan in the works to develop a Facebook app for Tumblr?

Marco: Not at all.

Facebook apps have their place. Tumblr can’t even let you poke someone, yet alone Super-Poke them. (My probably-incorrect capitalization and punctuation of that word shows how much I’m involved in Facebook.) They’re great for marketing and light fun.

But the risks and restrictions on Facebook apps makes them unsuitable for serious development. What if Facebook decides to change the rules or remove your app, and you have no recourse? What happens when the social trends shift next year and everyone moves to something else altogether, leaving you with an empty platform?

Facebook is a big website, sure. But in the young, web-savvy community, it’s easy to mistakenly assume that *our* community’s preferences and opinions reflect those of the entire internet-using population. And that’s simply not true. While it may seem to us that “everyone” is using Facebook, millions of people don’t. By developing an application exclusively for their walled garden, you’re unnecessarily limiting your potential audience to a small fraction of the people out there.

The standard, open internet is an excellent application platform with a massive audience. I’m not looking to leave it.

Being new to Tumblr, what tumblelogs would you recommend new users to follow?

Marco: Can’t go wrong with these:

http://tumbl.us/
http://cubicle17.com/
http://www.peterwknox.com/
http://cameron.io/
http://jakoblodwick.com/
http://numblr.nostrich.net/
http://lonelysandwich.com/
http://livejamie.com/

Also, I hear these guys have some inside info and Tumblr rumors:

http://www.davidslog.com/
http://tumblelog.marco.org/

Besides world domination and cold hard cash, what motivates you every day to work on Tumblr?

Marco: It’s a product that I love and use every day. That’s motivation enough.

When I’m working on projects that I don’t care about, I have no motivation. It’s a miserable experience. I’d rather turn down money than force myself to do something I don’t care about.

This mindset, obviously, didn’t do me any favors in school.

Changing gears …

The Butter Room is a mixture of technology, sports, and media. Therefore, what’s the best sporting event you ever attended?

Marco: I’m the worst person in the universe to ask about sports. I see how so many people in the world have these powerful, visceral reactions and emotions toward sports, and I just don’t understand the correlation. How do these games cause those effects?

Sports are one of the mysteries of the world to me - something I’ve accepted that I’ll never understand, even though millions of other people understand it perfectly. Like marketing language, fashion, and faith-based spirituality.

What is the best live music show you’ve been to? (I know it’s not the Almond Brothers. What’s up with that?)

Marco: My friend wrote that article and is still pretty annoyed that I didn’t fix it. He’s a smart guy, but a careless typer. It could have just been one wrong “Replace All”. But it’s pretty funny.

I haven’t been to a lot of shows myself, but my favorite was SR-71’s show in 2001 (touring “Now You See Inside”) in a small club in Columbus, Ohio (where I’m from). I’m a huge fan of 90’s rock (recognizing fully that they were in 2000 - that still counts), and most other shows I’ve seen were in giant amphitheaters where you can hardly even see the band. At that point, you might as well just listen to the CD at home for free. But SR-71’s show was energetic, fun, and personal. And it was only $15.

Any good books you’ve read lately that you would recommend?

Marco: I’m currently reading Scott Adams’ “The Dilbert Principle”. He’s a great writer - very entertaining, yet incredibly smart and thought-provoking. He could (and does) write about absolutely any topic, and it’s great.

More relevant to the trade, I also recently finished Jakob Nielsen’s “Prioritizing Web Usability”. That should be required reading for anyone making websites.

Red Sox or Yankees?

My sports preferences tend to be whatever has the lowest chance of causing me harm in my current location. I lived in Pittsburgh when they won the Super Bowl in 2006, so that was easy. But usually I’m the guy at the Super Bowl party asking, “Are we voting for the red team or the blue team?”

Since I currently live in New York, if I was forced to answer this question, I’d have to go with the Yankees on the basis that there are probably more people willing to come to my aid around here if I offend someone with that choice.

How is the back? Are you still standing all day while you code?

I do still stand, even though I’m about 50% back to normal. (Anything involving your back changes very slowly.) I probably could sit for at least half of the day and still be fine, but I don’t want to risk it. I’d rather get 100% better more quickly.

It’s really just a minor inconvenience at this point. It made me improve my posture, lose weight, strengthen my legs and core, and exercise regularly. There are plenty of worse things that happen to people. In the grand scheme of things, I have it pretty well. I really can’t complain.

(This was originally posted on our old platform on 12/30/97)

With the end of the year upon us, we reached out to the hardest working man on New Years Eve, Brad Serling of Nugs.net. Brad will be in Atlanta for New Years with Widespread Panic for their annual NYE gig so LiveWidespreadPanic.com can serve up FLAC and MP3 downloads of their show 48 to 72 hours after Panic finishes their encore. In addition to Panic, nugs.net will also be offering New Years shows from Umphrey’s McGee, moe., The Radiators, Yonder Mountain String Band, Tea Leaf Green, and Hot Buttered Rum.



The New York Times described Nugs.net as “A Johnny Appleseed of online concert recordings.” In case you are not fan of the jambands, Nugs.net offers soundboard recordings of complete live performances for a whole host of artists from the Grateful Dead to Metallica. I had the opportunity to work with Brad back in ‘03 on Musictoday’s Digital Download platform.

Kevin and I thank Brad for his time and thorough response.
***
2008 will be 15 years since you founded nugs.net. What’s the biggest thing that has changed in your experience with music downloading and music distribution since 1993?

Brad Serling: Ubiquitous broadband. My initial concept for nugs.net was a place to facilitate tape trading. In fact, the real genesis was a project I did with the guys who ran the Grateful Dead public FTP site at Berkeley. This was an unofficial Deadhead’s repository of all things Dead. I set up a folder there for tape traders to upload 30 second samples of their best Dead tapes as .AU files (the defacto audio format of the day). This was pre-MP3. The project never really took off, but it illustrates what a limiting factor bandwidth was back then. Now you can download a three hour concert in MP3 format in under five minutes. Pretty amazing leap!

What has been the best day and the worst day for Nugs.net?

Brad: The best day was New Year’s Eve 2002 at Madison Square Garden when the lights went down at Phish’s return from hiatus. I was set up next to one of my heroes, longtime Phish sound engineer Paul Languedoc, at the soundboard with my laptop, ready to capture that night’s show at 24 bit / 96KHz resolution, which Phish had never done before. I was so excited to see the band come back from hiatus, and frankly could not believe that they were allowing me to record the show and sell it the next day on LivePhish.com. The worst day was 24 hours later. I was frantically trying to get the New Year’s show up on LivePhish.com, bandwidth at the hotel was spotty, my wife somehow got a 24 hour flu, and I realized there was a major bug in my code which would prevent all those who pre-ordered the Phish New Year’s run from downloading it. Somehow we had to get on a plane to Hampton, VA for the next three shows and start the process all over again. We got to Hampton later that day and found a data center there who let me upload the shows on their high speed connections in exchange for tickets to that night’s show. By the next day the first two shows were up and I was able to patch the bug in the code after taking a beating from hard core fans in the forums and mailing lists. The deluge of emails and posts saying “I could’ve made a better LivePhish.com” was brutal to say the least. Talk about peer review. After all, I had been a taper since I was 14, and here I was living the tapers’ dream: officially engaged by the band to record and distribute their shows. High stakes for any starry eyed fan.

You are going to be in Atlanta for the Widespread Panic New Years Eve show, which will be available for download shortly after on LiveWidespreadPanic.com. Can you walk us through the entire process of producing a show for download?

Brad: The process really runs the gamut for each band. With Widespread Panic we do more production than most of our other artists. Panic’s front of house engineer Chris Rabold and system tech C.W. record the show in a variety of formats and hand off a 24bit / 48KHz stereo mix to me on DVD after the show. The mix is an on-the-fly blend of the house PA and stereo mics positioned at the soundboard. After the show I’ll usually forgo the typical beer and chicken wings backstage and head back to the hotel and start working on the show. I’ll load the full show onto my laptop and first make sure the show is complete, with no cuts or dropouts (it happens). Then I will drop markers for each song, add fades at the start and end of each set, and start the mastering process to even out the levels in order to make better sounding MP3s. Once the show is edited and rendered down to 16bit / 44.1 KHz WAV files for each track, I encode to MP3 and FLAC, tag all the files with artwork and metadata for that show, create the MP3 30 second samples, generate MD5 checksums for each file, and begin the publishing process. Once it’s staged on our servers, I test the download from start to finish and then send it live to the public. Then I will schedule an email announcement to the Live WP list to let fans know the show is ready. The Live WP site then auto-features the latest show on the homepage and show catalog, and auto publishes to LiveDownloads.com and nugs.net to increase traffic and visibility. Our art department then creates the downloadable labels and creates a set for the physical CDs. I then burn off a set of CD masters to fedex to our mastering house to fulfill all the CD orders for that show. If I’m lucky I’m asleep before daylight.

If I’m not at the show, the process takes several days as we’re waiting for the fedex of the DVD to come from the road. Bands who do their own editing and mastering can upload directly from the road, but for Panic we handle all the production and mastering so an upload of the raw files would take too long.

Is Panic going to dip into their archives anytime soon?

Brad: Absolutely. The band has already begun the selection process and we will be releasing shows on LiveWidespreadPanic.com as MP3 and FLAC downloads, as well on CD and CD+MP3 bundles where you can download the MP3 immediately and get the CD in the mail.

LivePhish.com had to be a significant event for Nugs.net. How did your relationship with Phish develop?

Brad: It’s funny, that’s probably the question I get asked most often. People assume I must have been buddies with the band or a friend of a friend, which is not the case at all. I was a fan just like everyone else, and even though I had been seeing Phish since 1990 I did not know anyone in the band or Phish organization. I was just a fan who did a really good job of releasing their music for free with their permission and without ripping them off. That’s what drew them to me. Actually, the Grateful Dead were the first to reach out to me. They called me up one day in 2000 and invited me up to their headquarters because they loved what I was doing with the nugs.net fan site. Three million free MP3 downloads a month of their music certainly got their attention. The fact that I was clearly doing it as a labor of love is what sealed the deal. The Dead hired me as a consultant and they had passed my name on to Dionysian, Phish’s management company. John Paluska, Phish’s manager, invited me to dinner before the “first last show ever” at Shoreline in 2000 and the rest, as they say, is history.



Can you give us a glimpse of what Phish might release in 2008 through LivePhish.com?

Brad: Currently Phish Archivist Kevin Shapiro is working on remasters of some of our most popular archive releases, like Nutter 97 and Durham 93. The remasters will come out on CD and new downloads and CD+MP3 bundles like our previous six releases. Aside from that, there are of course many shows in the queue. I keep pulling for Hampton 97, but it has yet to see the light of day. Kevin did play the epic Halley’s on our anniversary Phishcast yesterday, so thanks Kevin!

You launched the Nugs.net download service for The Philadelphia Orchestra earlier this year. What has been the level of interest in comparison to your rock n’ roll client base? Has it met/exceeded/fallen short of your expectations?

Brad: The Orchestra was a great opportunity and a great client, but certainly a grand experiment for us. I am from Philadelphia and my partner still lives there, so it was a natural connection. Incidentally, the Philadelphia Orchestra was the first orchestra to make an electronic recording of their music in the early 1900s, so it was a natural for them to be the first orchestra to directly distribute their performances to fans on their own web site.

In terms of quantifying success, Metallica it ain’t, to say the least. I have never done any market research on the classical music download market at large so I really have nothing to compare it to in order to gauge the success. My criteria for success is simple: is my client happy and are they reaching their fans and making them happy? By those metrics, the Orchestra is a huge success.

What are your top 3 recommendations in the nugs.net catalog?

Brad: Wow, that’s tough. I’ll stick with what my go-to shows I suppose—the ones I find myself listening to most often. (1) Hot Tuna from last year’s Merlefest. Just a spectacular recording and great acoustic performance. (2) Umphrey’s McGee New Year’s 04. I think I’m addicted to their cover of Sledgehammer, which is funny because I was never a huge fan of the Peter Gabriel’s original version. But the whole show is phenomenal and it’s another great sounding recording. (3) Grateful Dead at Family Dog from 1970. I’m a sucker for any 1970 Dead, and this is an awesome snapshot of the band in their prime with some nice filler thrown in from later in the year for good measure. And, of course, it sounds great too because it was mixed down from the multitrack tapes they literally found one day in the corner of the Vault.

When not seeing shows or working, you are __________?

Brad: Listening to shows ;-) Either that or playing guitar or attempting to play the mandolin.

What plans do you and Nugs.net have for 2008?

Brad: If I told you, I’d have to kill you.

How much horsepower does it take to serve up all of that audio? What’s the platform?

Brad: I’m platform agnostic, and I’ve learned the hard way not to put all my eggs in one basket.

What’s your ideal solution to copyright, fair use, and the controversies surrounding DRM?

Brad: How much time do you have? Honestly that’s beyond the scope of this discussion, so I would simply state that in any economy there are those who will always steal no matter what the price and those who will always pay given a fair price for the product or service they are interested. It’s called capitalism. The music business is no exception. Nugs.net is successful because we offer a reliable service of selling you last night’s show at a fair price. People rip us off all the time by illegally posting our artists’ intellectual property on file sharing sites, but those people would never pay for it anyway. Nevertheless, plenty of people want to support their favorite artist and know that by giving us their credit card they are putting money directly in their heroes’ pockets. That’s the intersection between art and commerce and we operate in that crosshair.

Is your business threatened by piracy? If so how and from where? If not, how do you manage to avoid it?

Brad: You’d be burying your head in the sand to say you can avoid piracy or that you have a way to prevent it. It’s not a study in ethics but rather factor of market forces.

Did you have an “aha” moment that gave birth to nugs or is it more like an idea you’ve nutured over time and whose time has come? Did you just look around the expanding taping sections, see hundreds of mic booms, and say “yeah, there’s a market here?”

Brad: I wish I could claim to be that smart. In reality, it was really more self-serving, yet selfless at the same time. When I hear something I like, my first thought is that I need to play this for my friends and turn them on to it. That’s the genesis of nugs.net. When I launched the nugs.net web site, it was a way for me to share my tape collection. I couldn’t keep up with all my friends’ requests for copies of my tapes so I built a web site to let them download copies themselves. I used to spend entire weekends in college copying tapes for people (this was before you could burn CDs). Once I entered the real world, I didn’t have that kind of time anymore so I needed a way to share my music more easily.

What is your favorite period or episode in history and why?

Brad: Right now. I can’t think of a more exciting time given all the technology at our fingertips. Politically and socially it may be the scariest time since the dawn of man, which might explain why we’re living in a tech-wonderland right now.